In depth: Vanguard Hybrid DPS for patch 2.4+

[Soulless]

C-tor, a POT5 Vanguard from Severity Gaming, is the current dps monster on the official forum leaderboard here: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=691926.

Paowee was nice enough to take the time and translate C-tor's parses and pick apart how C-tor plays.  From newbie to veteran, all skill levels of vanguards will find this very useful.  This guide contains rotation and a lot of explanation: http://swtorboard.org/2013/11/15/vanguard-powertech-dps/.

Curious, I took it a step further and found C-tor's profile and spec on Ask Mr. Robot. Got his spec (2-22-22), his gearing, and optimum stats: http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/character/58a438b4-3b13-4e4c-b72d-4e4484876f10.

 

As I have just got my Vanguard to 55, this was extremely helpful and takes all the worry and guessing out of "am I doing it right??" I hope it is just as helpful for you.

 

[Nwahs]

COOL!

[Soulless]

C-Tor's AMR profile changed: http://swtor.askmrrobot.com/character/58a438b4-3b13-4e4c-b72d-4e4484876f10

[Blasthardcheese]

So i would say to use the build.

 

But the rotation... meh.

 

My rotation is: Incindiary Round, Gut, Battle Focus + Relic of Boundless Ages, Ion Pulse, HIB, Stockstrike, (HIB if proc), then Ion Pulse with HIB if proc until 3 stacks of Pulse Generator, refresh IR and Gut, then use Reserve Power Cell + Pulse Cannon. And I never use anything after the 3 stacks of Pulse Generator except the proc HIB (IR and Gut are only used if they will go away while using Pulse Cannon.)

And there are times when I have to use one or two Hammer Shots, but I only use it when Ionic Accelerator (free HIB) doesn't proc when I need it to. You lose a minor amount of DPS, but it's better than running out of Cells.

 

If you do it in that order and use your abilities as they proc it will come out the same as, if not better than the suggested rotation in that article.

 

I'd like it if someone who is better at it than I am like Dordrac helped confirm or deny my findings, when he/they has/have time of course.

[Dordrac]

As of 2.6 on the PTS, this spec will no longer work if the changes stay as is on the update. Now we will have to use to the very mediocre Tactics and Assault specs for DPS, which parse on average 200+ less than the hybrid.

[Soulless]

Yep.  When 2.6 is pushed out - I will most likely delete this thread as it will be incorrect and useless.

[Dordrac]

I don't know why Bioware hasn't buffed the other specs to put them more in line with this spec though as far as DPS. Even the hybrid was actually several hundred DPS behind where Gunslingers, sentinels, commandos, and other high DPS classes are right now. This might make me start playing my Gunslinger a lot more depending on how hard my dps is hit.

[Nwahs]

Because I don't think it's fair to expect Bioware to make every DPS class the same DPS, each class brings something different to the table

[Dordrac]

However, when I'm playing a class that has far less utility for a group than a gunslinger or a sentinel AND less dps, there's a problem. If I had a lot of utility to help the group out by what you're saying then I should have less DPS, so in a sense because gunslingers and sentinels bring a lot more useful abilities to the table, well they should have less DPS than a class that brings less, yet that isn't the case. Really in the terms of the whole group, the only thing I really have is the harpoon.

Those two classes bring much more to a group, and can do a large amount more DPS than vanguards are capable of.

[Soulless]

Here is the thing about DPS classes.  Their priority for existence in raid is DPS.  They all have other things they bring to the table, but the main reason they are there, and why they exist, is to hurt things.  All dps classes should be able to put out the same dps.  

Right now it's not possible, and for some classes the skill curve is brutal.  I think it's fair to have harder skill curves for some classes, but some are kind of ridiculous right now.

I agree that each class brings something to the table, but each class should also bring comparable dps to the table along with the specific utility type they bring.  There are definitely some classes right now that just can't compete in DPS.

While a Gunslinger can come to the table with great dps AND can cleanse themselves, a Vanguard cannot cleanse themselves and will struggle without tweaks to their non-hybrid builds.  Vanguards stable is being able to assist with cd's and taunting in an emergency.

Similar with Sentinel, they can't cleanse themselves but can buff the entire raid.  They are blessed with great DPS.

One trend I see in classes struggling in DPS category: They are ALL tank classes: Shadow, Guardian, Vanguard.

What this means is that there is a reason Bioware is struggling: balance.  They don't know how to buff the dps whilst not making an OP class in PvP.  We all know Hybrid Shadow was crazy... they don't want that again.  

But - that doesn't mean that a guardian shouldn't be able to show up in Vengence and hang with a Gunslinger.  That a Vanguard can assault spec or tactic spec and be on par with Sentinel.

Bioware needs to work on that - and honestly that is always a big struggle in every MMO.  It will get there.. they just have to take their careful steps.

[Soulless]

Right as I posted the above, I found this out: http://pax-republica.guildlaunch.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=9935718&p=35288302&gid=118791#35288302

Guardians ARE getting some love in the DPS department