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Blasthardcheese
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re: Blast's ISP issues

First off, I don't need an LOA or anything like that. But my Forum activity, which has been lacking already, will drop to almost nothing for a while. Why? Well I'll tell you. Buckle up and have some coffee. This is a long one.

 

As you may know, I've been having trouble with my ISP. It started over a year ago with internet loss when it would rain or snow. It then escalated over the months to severe latency issues (resulting in 50%+ packet loss). Keep in mind that I WAS calling them about these issues and they were unable to resolve them.

One day while talking to whom I thought was just a worker that answers the phones and troubleshoots but is really the assistant manager (Tina), I start getting ignored and talked down to (indirectly) while trying to figure out the issue causing the severe latency. After being given a very stupid suggestion that I informed will cause issues and the loss of the call, I call back and get screamed at because it didn't work. (Fun fact: The Assistant manager is the kind of person that, along with a demeaning attitude, believes that the more bandwidth you have, the less lag you have. That is a major misconception.)

A tech was sent out, he did nothing but check the line, got paid and left.

Finally I get a tech that I was told (by the assistant manager) is the assistant manager. Wrap your brain around that. He comes out. He uses a latency tester set to only 5 hops. I have ping -t running in two DOS windows to two different IP addresses. They clearly show that the latency issues are not constant and often have 10+ hops before problems arise. He uses the tester and sees no latency issues. He says, "I don't see anything. I guess it's gone." I said, "It's not constant. test it again." This happened at least three more times. I said that testing five hops isn't enough. Set it to fifteen. We went through the above several more times. He calls the office. They don't see any issues "The speed is fine. They shouldn't have any issues."

We didn't get charged for the service call, thankfully. Before he left he said, "I don't understand how you can game on a 1.5mb connection. I don't understand how you can have that (the ping -t) running at all." In other words, he thinks that you can't do anything on a 1.5mb connection. Which is so false, it's not even funny. Cringe my guildies. It hurts my brain just to remember it.

I found out my router's firmware was way out of date (using v117 and the latest was v132). I updated the firmware and a lot of it went away. Did that fix it? No. Because I had major latency issues when bypassing the router.

With a lot of issues and a failure to have the issue resolved, I filed an FCC report (net neutrality rules were not in place yet). It was a rage post for sure. I didn't cuss, but I did call folks incompetent. A lot of it was a test to see what the FCC would do. I wanted to see how they handle things from a post like that. I wanted to see what they would act on. I wish I could link to it. I got a response from my ISP about how they can't guarantee VoIP quality. Bull crap. TS works just fine when I'm not lagging like crazy. We also didn't have trouble until the latency issues started.

 

Fast forward six months. I start seeing indications of throttling. At exactly 4:00 P.M. my bandwidth usage when watching a YouTube video would drop from 1456.35 to 234.21 (not exact numbers). At 10:00 P.M. exactly, it would return to normal. The connection to TOR and STO becomes unplayable. Web searching is unaffected. I asked around and nobody could suggest anything else it could be. With the memory and lack of desire to call and get yelled at again I just filed an FCC report for throttling. Should I have called first? Yes. It was a mistake not to. But I didn't want to get screamed at and ignored some more. I put those exact words in my report too. So the FCC knows it was a full conscious decision to not call.

A few days later I get a letter of disconnection. The letter reads: "We have received (my name's) second FCC letter. We are sorry you are having troubles. Since we are unable to meet your needs, we will be disconnecting your service upon receipt of this letter. You will not be charged for your march service through the date of disconnect. IT IS NOT WITHIN THEIR RIGHT DO TO THAT! I called to talk with the manager on the 18th of March (Friday). It was close to closing time and I missed him. Arrangements were made for him to call me the 21st (Monday) in the morning. I waited all day and never got a call. I called in the next morning about it. I was told he's out of town and won't be back sometime the next week. I tried to get a specific date but wasn't given one.

At 5:20 P.M. Monday morning the 21st, we were disconnected. I did some looking around and found that they cannot do that and is probably grounds for a bigger claim. I called the FCC Wednesday the 23rd and was told that it is NOT within their right to do that. No ISP can disconnect you for any reason other than unpaid bills. I was told that other than adding to my open complaint, I can file a complaint to the BBB, the State's Attorney General, or even to a claims court. But my ISP is required to reconnect our service.

I called my ISP back. I mistakenly got into a bit of a "who can talk louder than the other" match with the AM, during which I was told how they can do it (lol nope). Then I was asked if I or my father was talking. I told her it was me and she just hung up. BAD MOVE LADY. I called back again and said the FCC said you are not in your right to do it and that you need to reconnect us. She refused it again and hung up.

I then had my dad call them and told them that I am the one authorized to handle the I.T. stuff and that they need to deal with me, like it or not (It went fairly well. He tried handling it against my suggestions, but it didn't help. Whatever). I could hear her going on about how she disconnected us for not wanting to deal with an unhappy customer. How it was so horrible that I called her incompetent. I never cussed her or anyone else out. She says, "What am I supposed to do with a customer like that? They do nothing but complain. I'm not dealing with it." She goes on about how my complaint was about us getting 1.5mb (my complaint about that was that they haven't upgraded that in ten years). FINALLY I get the call turned over to me.

I tried one more time to explain that they can't do what they did. I got hung up on again. Fortunately it was lunch time and she was on lunch break. I got the actual person that answers the phone. She's very nice and very helpful. You can hear her kindness it in her tone. I asked to speak with Management. It was then that I found out the lady I've been dealing with IS the Assistant Manager. I need to wait for the Manager to get back at some unknown date to talk with him and go from there.

 

And that's where I am at right now. I'm using phone tethering. I will still be in game. I'm trying to not use up all of my phone data. Unfortunately not every day do I get a good enough signal to do much of anything. I can see GM, but it all depends on if I look at my phone which his high up on a shelf to get a signal, if it's even where it can get a signal at all, and if the signal is getting is any good to not have a big delay in messages coming through.



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Blasthardcheese
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re: Blast's ISP issues

TL;DR: Please read at least the paragraphs with bold and/or italic lettering. People at my ISP are being stupid. Whiny even. Certain individuals are getting the company into trouble. Deep trouble if they don't stop.

Remember: Your ISP can NOT disconnect you for any reason other than unpaid bills. The FCC said so. Be calm when talking with them. Don't make my mistake and get into even a small yelling match. Keep trying. DO NOT get mad and let that guide your responses. It's hard not to. Trust me, I know all too well. Stay calm and you will stay in the right. Be willing to admit when you are wrong, no matter what, and you will stay in the right, or even have things go smoother. File an FCC report if you get nowhere like I have. You have the BBB and State's Attorney General at your disposal too. Though that last one is for really bad cases like mine is going. Use the info at this link as a guide: http://lifehacker.com/how-to-file-a-complaint-against-your-isp-and-finally-so-1714876357



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re: Blast's ISP issues

Holy wowza. That is awful.

Also lol to people thinking 1.5 isn't enough. I use to game on less than 1!

I feel your pain. I really hope it gets resolved soon!



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re: Blast's ISP issues

That's  about insane.  Really, they only offer 1.5?  That's stone age speeds.  Too many devices running at my home to work with that.  Hope you can get it corrected sooner rather than later.



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re: Blast's ISP issues

There are no words..



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re: Blast's ISP issues

Wow, that's a nightmare. Are any of your neighbours using the same ISP? Do they see the same issues? Perhaps a larger number of affected customers could collectively make more "noise" for the ISP that they would take notice of. 

There are a couple of other network tests you could run in order to build up evidence of the problem. Normally when I run into intermittent issues like yours I like to take multiple sets of results for comparison. Usually I would advise to run the tests every 2/3 hours each day for a week or two to establish the pattern (if there is one). You're already using ping -t which is useful on default settings but it also has some options for broader testing. This is the list of tests:

> ping -t

Run three of these...first to an IP from your ISP like their DNS server, second should be something like google.com and the last one should be an IP in another country and preferably transatlantic e.g. google.ie

> ping 8.8.8.8 -t -l: 4096

This one targets the primary google dns server with a continuous ping but uses a larger 4k packet to do so. It gives a better indication of how the connection runs under more load. You can run a second one using 8.8.4.4 for a side by side comparison as that is the secondary google dns server.

> tracert x.x.x.x

Run one of these for each IP address that you used in the ping tests. It will show you the specific hops (routers) between you and the destination exposing the network path(s). Once you have enough data samples for comparison you may be able to identify specific parts of the path where the problem shows up. It may be as simple as a specific hop showing increased response times during a period of the day when the connection is poor.

> pathping

This is a modified version of tracert that Microsoft include in Windows. It runs a standard tracert but then it stress tests each hop with 100 packets to ascertain packet loss across the entire path. Run one for each of the target IP addresses.

> speedtest.net

For each time period you run the tests you should go to this site and use it to record your upstream and downsteam speeds. It's useful to have those numbers to show "simpler" empirical data about your connection over a period of time.

I know that's a lot of stuff to be doing and can be time consuming to do it but if you build  up a couple of weeks of data using 4/5 series of tests for each day you will have a lot of evidence for how your connection performs that will make it very difficult for your ISP to ignore. Worst case scenario they do actually ignore it but you can still provide it as evidence when you take them to court. 

Hopefully this all gets sorted out before too long, I know how frustrating unstable connectivity can be.

 

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re: Blast's ISP issues

/hug



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 sorry buddy.  /hug.    I hope it gets resolved.  Like you said, be honest and stay in the right, things will work out as they are supposed to.  I can't imagine the stress I would feel if I couldn't game when I wanted to.  (Thanks Ciervo :)  ) 



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re: Blast's ISP issues

The other provider that I want to switch to has Satellite service as a placeholder until their terrestrial service is available. If I get nowhere with the manager, I'll be switching to that and file a BBB and Attorney General report.

 

Swishy I tried to tell that tech guy the same thing. I tried to tell him that I play TWO games at the same time WHILE playing YouTube videos at 480p and never had any issues at all.

 

I appreciate the suggestions Nemasis, but those tests are what have had me aware of all the trouble the last few years. In fact, I recommend HTML5 tests over testers that use Flash. They're far more accurate. dslreports.com/speedtest is one of the best. It has an HTML5 test and nice explanations on how things work. I didn't mention it, but that post is a very very very brief version of what has happened. I''m far past the testing stage by two years.

ping 8.8.8.8 -t -l: 4096 is one I'm not fully aware of, but I know how my 1.5mb connection performs under load. It sucks. Big time. 



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re: Blast's ISP issues

Heya Dude, I feel your pain. When I first started in IT, I was doing Helpdesk for Cable modems, back in the days when they were brand new. Like less than 5000 people in Chicagoland that had it. I remember when 10000 people subscribed, the company went nutz. Big party, bonuses, was good times. Then the thing exploded, couldn't find qualified people in the field to be techs or customer support.

I sympathize with what you have been through, and for sure in this modern age of customer service, you  shouldn't have been treated the way that your were. We had cases similar to yours when I worked in support. One that will I will never forget for as long as I live was a call i got for a guy that would lose his connection seemingly randomly, and frequently. He was working fine the first month or so when he got it, but things went south. Like once every hour and always only for a few minutes, his connection would drop. The problem persisted for months. Solutions offered varied based on who he talked to. Many trucks were rolled, one tech even told him to erase and re-install windows. When he got to my phone, i insisted he work only with me. We then attacked the problem methodically.

The guy was pleasant to deal with, but very frustrated (I am sure you can empathize). Making matters worse for me, he was on the village board of the town he was in. Cable was VERY political back them (probably still is) since a it was the town's council that chose what cable company was going to service the city since the technology at the time allow only one provider. (All of their accounts were flagged in our system so we knew to 'pucker up' when they called in)

I had senior network operations involved, senior field technicians, and even the manager of  construction and new cable plant  involved. They ran brand new lines from the plant, to his house, ran a new line in his house to the modem, fished it through is basement walls and everything. They tried new modems, even prototype ones, also bought a brand new out of the box laptop for testing, but the problem persisted. The climax came when everyone was over at his house trying to figure it out. You know what finally clued everyone in to the problem? He offered the people there something to drink. (You ready for this?)

After he was initially installed for service, he rearranged things in his basement. What did he put next to the wall where his cable line is run? His refrigerator. Like a 1970's refrigerator. Whenever the fridge turned on to cool, it created enough EMI that the cable signal dropped out, and his connection along with it. When he offered the guys drinks, the door was left opened, it turned on, and the connection dropped. Once they moved the fridge away from the wall that had his cable in it, the problem vanished.

We laughed about it after the fact. It was the running joke for about a year afterward as it lead to support techs asking 'Is your refrigerator running?' when someone called in with an intermittent connection problem. The reality is that had nobody been there to notice that, his problem wasn't gonna get fixed. All the department heads couldn't explain his problem, and were tired of rolling trucks. Subscriptions back then were like $25 a month and we probably spend $10000 in labor costs alone in troubleshooting it. If they hadn't solved it that night, our VP was on call to explain to him it was gonna be a 'take it or leave it' situation. Continue to pay for the service as it was, or disconnect it. The company didn't want to spend any more time on it.

It is actually because of this case that our region made policy for upgrading from RG-59 coax cable to RG-6 Mandatory for all cable modem installs. This created a lot of angry calls from people believe it or not. Lots of people wanted to use their existing wiring, which was in many cases already concealed and presentable rather than have the installer trudge another cable through their walls. (Techs rarely care about appearance). We also had cases where people moved the modem in their house to where another Coax outlet was and their connection wasn't as good. Lots of fun were those calls.

I think back to those days fondly but i would NEVER want to support public internet connections ever again. There are so many combinations of Modems, routers, switches and devices out there. Not to mention the different way to use them such as netflix, whole home connectivity appliances, or even multiroom TV on a single converter. Unless I was in their house and knew everything they were doing, there is no way I would be able to discover their 'running refrigerator'.

I told ya that story to illustrate that you might be in a similar situation. Not excusing your treatment at all by their managers and service reps, I want to believe that things truly do look 'OK' On their end. Nemasis had a great question about your neighbors experience. Oversaturation of clients for sure could be the issue, but your provider would know that if that was the case. And while they wouldn't never admit it, they would have focused more on apologizing rather than confronting you if that was the case. If your neighbors have issues at the same time, move evidence for the plight.

I know you said your service is disconnected at the moment, but in the interests of solving the problem (Which I am sure nobody wants right now more than you) I do have some tips if it gets turned back on.

The idea is to take as many of the variables out of the picture as you can while being consistent in your testing. To me, if I was your tech, I would want you to get as direct of a connection as you possible can to the modem itself. I don't know what hardware you have on your network, but you specifically mentioned that you get major latency when you bypass your router. To me that is a BIG indicator of a problem with one of those two components. Modem or computer.

The computer should be able to connect directly to the modem, without latency, without issues. If that can't be achieved without adding a router to the mix, that is a big red flag for me. The router may make it appear to go away, but likely it is masking it. The fact that you mentioned updating the routers firmware seems to have impacted the problem, again make me suspicious of something outside your provider directly.

The Best thing I can suggest to determine which one is having problems is of course trying a different computer plugged directly into the modem (you will need to power cycle the modem each time you switch computers out). If the second PC cannot connect without latency directly to the modem, my stink eye would be pointed at the modem. If it connects fine.. well now you are getting somewhere.

It could be the modem is malfunctioning or even that it doesn't 'get along' with your particular Network card in your PC. As silly as that sounds, you would be surprised how often that happens. If ya check out the 1GB Network cards at amazon.com, there are tons of em. All ranging from like $10 to like $300. Manufacturers you may not have ever known existed. I am not saying the most expensive is always the best, but if they are 1GBs cards, meaning top speed is all the same, what justifies the price difference?

Bus type, bus speed, Packet size, QoS support, buffer size, frame size, chipset, secondary support chips, all sorts of techno mumbo jumbo that guys WAY smarter than me can speak to as to how it all has improved over the years. The more expensive cards could have features and flexibility the the bargain basement cards don't.  You could check for Firmware and driver updates for your NIC in your PC to see if that helps, or even a new card altogether. (I would borrow a PC from a friend before I threw money at this)

I know it's frustrating, and your provider is doing you no service in their treatment of you. And yea, if your area is over saturated, or they have plant issues at your house, none of the above is gonna matter. But as the saying goes, when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, no matter however improbable, must be the truth. So uhm......Is your refrigerator running?

Hang in there dude!

 

 

 

 

 

 



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re: Blast's ISP issues

Read and reread this multiple times, I can't seem to fully grasp her attitude. (As I do sales for a living). Hopefully the FCC helps ya out! Wish I could.

Blasthardcheese
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I appreciated that story Iolo. Cringe worthy indeed. At least that guy was pleasant to deal with. Tina has just been a complete... y'know. Maybe they put their hair care products next to the equipment and that's why it's malfunctioning.

As far as any variables, we'll never know because lady dippy sticky isn't calling Cogent to see if there are any other issues. She won't even contact any techs to figure it out. It is just her and one other in the office 95% of the time. I'm sure things look okay on their end. And it will when you don't have a clue, or your system is set up for the ignorant. And they're not oversaturated. They're losing customers. As Wisper keeps expanding their coverage, Buttcomm keeps losing customers. Ruralcomm has actually started putting up ads to try and get customers. Nobody wants their crappy out of date service.

All computers are having the same troubles. Bypassing the router resulted in the same issues. Updating the firmware seemed to fix it, but I'm quite confident that that was merely coincidence as I was having the severe latency even when bypassing the router. And there is no Modem. It uses PoE. I'm also a quarter of a mile away from the silo their antenna is on with a clear view of it. There is nothing to block any signal.

Having a cousin that is ~15 years older than me that has been dealing with computer/network I.T. stuff most of his life (not the doofus microsoft lover Tina kind of I.T., the intelligent x system is good for x reasons, but y is best because x reason while z system is stupid for x reason despite y feature kind) is a nice bonus because I can run any of this by him once I hit my knowledge/ability limit.

 

I have another update: I attempted to contact the Manager of Ruralcomm. I was denied by the Assistant manager. She repeatedly claimed ownership of the company despite my insistence. Through persistence I was told he’s out of the country, and he’s rarely there, so they do not know when he will be back. So it would seem that full responsibility is set on the Assistant manager.

 

We are forced to forward our business calls to my father’s cell phone, and switch to Wisper’s Satellite internet until their terrestrial service is available and we can resume operations normally again. All of the denial of service and disconnection comes from the assistant manager. I have yet to be able to contact the Manager himself. There are no other providers to choose from that will not result in a continued detriment to our business at this time. The denial of service for such petty reasons is hurting our business and full use of the internet both for business and personal use. We provide an emergency 24 hour service, and this lack of internet, and the restrictions due to high latency caused by a satellite service is of great detriment to that.

 

Now the question is, will I be able to do Ops? Anything not progression. I should be able to do things like HM EV though. Anything more difficult than (maybe) EC HM, I'll probably need to be carried through. HA HA HA HA! We'll see.

 

Thanks for the replies and suggestions. I will be back to more action soon!



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Blasthardcheese
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The update was a copy+paste of part of my FCC follow up draft in Google Docs. It was easier than retyping. That's why the font is different.

I also forgot to add that I will be making a BBB and possibly Illinois Attorney General complaints. If Tina gets fired, that's a good thing. If Buttscamm gets shut down, that's even better!

And if you ever wonder about them, Google Ruralcomm, and look at the street view of their address. That'll tell ya quite a bit about them. No business that is decent will leave it like that. Just sit there and soak it all in. To answer any questions: I don't know.



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Update!!!! I went to a friends house to do updates, download tv show episodes, and leave an update here. I ran out of high speed data on my phone, so I'm on a 2G signal. BLEGH!!!!! As much as I'd like to go there and play TOR, it just wouldn't work. For one thing, I can't drive over every time I want to, and the seating arrangement isn't comfortable enough for it.

 

I finally got an installer for WISPER to set up an installation appointment. It is supposed to be this Sunday at 1 PM. The installer is clearly far more knowledgeable than anyone at Ruralcomm. Easily. Yeah he tried to make a sale and said a few things that a little goofy, but definitely has knowledge. You can tell he's trained. He made sure I was aware of all my options, he asked plenty of questions so he is prepared, and even admitted that he didn't have personal experience with the router I had and the Satellite setup (my router is perfectly fine for it btw). When he asked what service I had before, and I said "Ruralcomm", his response was "I'm sorry. I feel your pain. I'm so sorry."

 

I really hope the weather holds up, because it might be quite a while before I'd get another appointment to do it.  I logged in briefly to get my TOR fix, but that's all I can do until I get internet at home. It will not be too long before I get more data on my phone, so if it turns out I won't have internets by Sunday it won't be too bad.

 

I appreciate the support and replies. It helps me know that everyone is aware of my situation rather than this getting buried and everyone wondering.



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good luck i hope that goes well!



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